Announcement: 0:01

Hello and welcome to the Waking Up to Grace podcast, where we celebrate and explore the finished work of our Lord Jesus Christ. Tune in to the Waking Up to Grace podcast on every major platform. You can also listen to our episodes and read our full transcripts at wakinguptogracecom. And now here's Lenny.

Lenny: 0:23

Welcome back to the podcast, everyone.

Melissa: 0:26

Welcome back.

Lenny: 0:27

This week we're going to be getting back into our Roman study, going through Romans, chapter 1, verses 1 through 7. Jesus is Lord and he chose you, Melissa.

Melissa: 0:38

Thanks be to God for that.

Lenny: 0:40

Amen. So last week we got into 1 John 1-9 a bit and abiding became a big topic of conversation.

Melissa: 0:48

Yes.

Lenny: 0:49

So, going into this episode, I thought it'd be relevant to sum up that our Lord is always abiding in us as believers, and as believers, we're always abiding in Christ, aren't we? Melissa?

Melissa: 0:59

We are.

Lenny: 1:00

When you take that concept. It becomes very confusing when you have John in his first epistle telling believers to abide in Christ. Yes, and I think that gets a lot of people hung up, and it took me a while to process it myself, but I came to realize that it's not as confusing as it seems. We're saved when we believe, but believing in Yeshua is contrary to our human intellect. So we have to train our minds to think in line with this new divine nature.

Lenny: 1:31

We have to live out our belief in order to bear the fruits of the Spirit. By this I mean we need to depend on our sovereign Lord. We need to rely on Him for all things, look to Him for all things, pray in all things and believe that he is our life force. We have to believe it right, amen. We have to have faith that his spirit living in and through us is a powerful, life-changing force. It's not so much about the amount of faith, as it is the object of our faith, and from what I've learned, the object of our faith should be the finished work of Christ Yeshua Agreed, not our own works. His finished work becomes the driving force, because that's where we learn the magnitude of that love of God.

Melissa: 2:17

That's right.

Lenny: 2:18

So there's a lot of confusion between the Old and the New Covenants. The cross of Christ was that dividing line, but it's hard for people to see it. In light of that, most people are going to tell you to focus on your behavior. Get your behavior right and then God will bless you and you'll be right with God. You'll be seen as holy before God through your behavior. So basically, once you become a Christian, it's your responsibility to stop sinning. You got to stop sinning.

Melissa: 2:46

It's a common thought.

Lenny: 2:47

Yeah, and we see in scripture that sin is not the end result. That's not what we're looking to do. We're not looking to build upon our sin life. But from my vantage point, sin is a result of not abiding. The core problem is that we're not abiding in Christ and that's why the sin and that's why the result will just be more sin. When we're not abiding, it's when we shift our focus away from our Heavenly Father, away from the finished work of Christ. We begin to doubt His finished work and put confidence in our own ability. That's when sin comes strongly back into focus and we stumble.

Melissa: 3:25

So it's very important what we're focusing on day to day, minute to minute.

Lenny: 3:31

Yeah, and you see it in scripture. You see Paul talking about self-effort. We talk about self-effort a lot and it's usually in regards to the law when we see it in scripture. But self-effort in regards to the law can also be self-effort in regards to rules and regulations. I just wanted to clarify that when I'm saying self-effort in a negative sense, I'm referring to that old self, that old self that was crucified with Christ, not the new self that was resurrected by his life, not the new creation self, because that self is good. Our self is not necessarily bad. I guess is what I'm trying to say. It's when we start acting like that old self, that old self that's not drawing from the vine, that's when self becomes a problem well, the old self is dead it's dead, but we seem to want to resurrect it back up and start behaving like that dead person.

Melissa: 4:25

Right, that's a pretty big deal.

Lenny: 4:30

So we're going to be talking about God's sovereignty today and his power, and so I think it's important to mention that abiding is not automatic. We're not puppets and robots. As we read in John's first epistle and in all of scripture, belief was something that we need to cling to. We're taught to pray for this, we're taught to desire this, and if we don't desire it, we should pray for it. Our Lord doesn't want us to be independent of him. He wants us to want him. His will is for us to call on him and depend on him, but also to be alert to his guidance. I mean, what good would it be if we're praying and we're not looking for the answer? We're not looking for what he's telling us, we're not looking for what he's teaching us. What good is prayer if we're not looking for his response? So true. So he gives us this ability to please him within his sovereign will, but his will is like the umbrella that preserves and protects all things under it. He can and will change our mind at times, and at other times he'll wait for our response.

Lenny: 5:28

Once the Lord opens our eyes and gives us life, scripture indicates that we can live a life of unbelief. We don't have to abide in the grace we were saved by. We can choose to behave like that old self and be guided by rules and regulations. Those guided by rules and regulations cannot function under freedom. That's why they hate the gospel of grace. Rules are the only thing stopping them from carrying out sin, so they feel the need to impose them on others. Then, on the other hand, we can just choose to take that gift of salvation and use our freedom for sin. Say gee, thanks God, see you later. We can choose to live the way we feel like living and just be completely ignorant to what our Lord would desire for us in our lives. Both of these paths are led by error and a lack of mind renewal.

Melissa: 6:14

That's right.

Lenny: 6:16

So I just wanted to mention those things as kind of an introduction. But now we're going to start digging into our Romans passage. Let's just dig right in. What do you think, Melissa? Our first passage is going to start digging into our Romans passage. Let's just dig right in. What do you think, Melissa? Our first passage is going to be Romans, chapter 1, verses 1 through 4 in the ESV.

Melissa: 6:30

Paul, a servant of Christ Jesus, called to be an apostle set apart for the gospel of God, which he promised beforehand through his prophets in the holy scriptures concerning his son. All right.

Lenny: 7:01

So what we're seeing here is that Paul is declaring that Jesus is Lord.

Melissa: 7:07

Yes.

Lenny: 7:08

Yeshua is the Lord. He came in human form, but he also came in the power of God.

Melissa: 7:15

He did.

Lenny: 7:16

What was the ultimate display of that power, according to this passage?

Melissa: 7:21

Why it was the resurrection from the dead.

Lenny: 7:23

It was his resurrection from the dead. It was his resurrection from the dead, so he was displaying the power of God through his resurrection from the dead.

Melissa: 7:31

He was being glorified by the Father right.

Lenny: 7:33

Yes. So when we think about power, I think we all have a pretty good idea what power would be. As we know, in the age of signs and wonders, god was displaying his power miraculously. There was the first exodus, where Israel came out of Egypt. There's a 40-year exodus, and then, from the cross on to the destruction of Jerusalem, there was another 40-year exodus.

Melissa: 7:56

The second exodus.

Lenny: 7:57

Full of signs and wonders and miracles. So God's power was being displayed there mightily. I know you had looked up the definition of power. Mm-hmm, I did, and you want to read those definitions and then from there I was going to read some passages in Scripture, just to give us an idea of what that power is referring to.

Melissa: 8:16

That sounds good. I looked up power in the Webster's Dictionary and I came up with some definitions here, such as the ability to act or produce an effect, a position of ascendancy over others, authority, a sovereign state, physical might, mental or moral vigor, the resulting product, force or energy used to do work, and again energy force, main might, muscle and potency.

Lenny: 8:54

If we take that and apply it to God's power, it's magnified greatly as opposed to what we consider human power Absolutely. So when God's displaying his power, he's displaying things that humans can't do. We were talking this week about the power. You had mentioned some passages that you were looking at. Did you want to share those passages at all?

Melissa: 9:18

I just found it interesting as I was reading in Romans what we just read there Romans 1, 1 through 4, where Paul mentions Christ was declared to be the Son of God in power, according to the Spirit of holiness, by his resurrection from the dead. And then in my readings throughout the week I came across in Ephesians, chapter 3, verse 16, paul's mentioning that, talking to the believers, he's mentioning that, according to the riches of his glory, he may grant you to be strengthened with power through his spirit in your inner being. So that sounded parallel to me to Christ in his power being resurrected. And then he strengthens us with his power as believers through the Holy Spirit.

Lenny: 10:11

Yeah, and when we were talking about that it became sort of an argument that we were having, Not a vicious argument. But I had a different thought on power when we were talking about power, Because I was thinking of it as the miraculous power. So you're reading that passage and thinking of it as the miraculous power.

Lenny: 10:25

So you're reading that passage and saying, as believers, we have this power. We do have the power of the Spirit of God living inside of us. Yes, but what's the difference between us and the church that Paul was speaking to? There were some differences Because that early church, in that first century, during the second exodus that we were talking about, they had miraculous powers. That's right. We can't necessarily impose that passage upon ourselves in that exact context. So when I was meditating on that, we were discussing it back and forth. At first we thought, oh, we don't agree on this, but I wanted you to share that because it's actually a really important conversation about power.

Lenny: 11:10

I think it's important to understand that, especially when we're reading scripture, reading letters like Paul's letter to the Corinthians, and even in Ephesians. There they had spiritual gifts given to them by God. Yes, so what is a gift? It would be something that was given to you that you didn't work for. Our salvation was a gift from God. He gave it to you. So, a spiritual gift, we have several if you look at scripture knowledge, leadership, prophecy, speaking in tongues, teaching, wisdom. Okay. So if that was a gift given to you by God, let's just look at teaching. If God gave you the gift of teaching, how good of a teacher would you be?

Melissa: 11:53

Oh, you'd be the best.

Lenny: 11:55

You'd be the best. You'd be an excellent teacher. And if he gave you knowledge, how good would your you be? Oh, you'd be the best. You'd be the best, you'd be an excellent teacher. And if he gave you knowledge, how good would your knowledge be? It would be far above others. It would be perfect. It would have been given to you divinely. That means God wasn't working through their human abilities and their human intellect in order to give them these things. I know that there's a lot of charismatics out there that understand this concept, because I've had somebody tell me one time that God gave me the gift of knowledge. He told me that I've never read the Bible before, but I picked it up and started reading and God gave me a divine understanding of the scripture. He understood that God's gift of knowledge was something that was given to you. You could set your Bible on the nightstand and go to bed and wake up with knowledge without ever having read it.

Melissa: 12:42

Wow.

Lenny: 12:43

So can you see what I mean by gift? Yes, so I don't believe we have those gifts today. I believe that was part of the second exodus. They were signs and wonders. It was God displaying his power through that second exodus in a big way. They were miracles. Those aren't the norm, but at that time they were the norm. They were healing people. They were raising the dead. There was a guy that fell out a window. Paul went down, put his hands on him. He came alive. Who's doing that today?

Melissa: 13:12

We're not seeing that today. What we talked about that was jumpstarting the church.

Lenny: 13:16

Yeah, we're not seeing that today but we talked about that was jumpstarting the church. Yeah, so when we look at the second exodus you know you have the cross on to the destruction of Jerusalem, there was a time period where the new covenant was established in itself. There was a transition period. The new covenant began at the cross and then was established in itself on until the destruction of the temple, when God divorced the people of Israel. The body of Christ became the church, believers became the church.

Melissa: 13:42

Right.

Lenny: 13:48

So they had miraculous gifts during the age of signs and wonders. There was miraculous gifts going on in Paul's letter to the Corinthians. They were having a hard time understanding how to organize all this stuff that they had going on. When we say spiritual gifts don't exist today in the supernatural way, I think it's easy to be discouraged. I know when I first heard the concept I was like what are you trying to say? The Spirit of God is just dormant, powerless, dead.

Melissa: 14:09

Yeah, we talked about that.

Lenny: 14:11

To speak on what you were saying. We have the power of the Spirit of God working in us.

Melissa: 14:17

We do.

Lenny: 14:18

It's common that people say well, what's your spiritual gift? You can take a test to see what your spiritual gift is. But if you're not even a Christian, you could take that test and you would have a spiritual gift. So how does that make any sense?

Melissa: 14:31

Right.

Lenny: 14:33

But what we see is that the Spirit of God is still a force of power working within us. We have a counselor. Now, basically, is how I would see it. The unbelieving world is not counseled. They have no guide. They have no leadership, nowhere to turn. They have no idea where they're at, where they're going, they're lost. I once was blind and now I see they don't have a counselor to guide them. So we have the Spirit of God living in and through us, counseling us, guiding us, teaching us. So when we read our scripture, we can pray and we can understand, we can desire, and God will give us these things, but he's going to teach us through our human abilities. We're going to have to read in order to understand scripture.

Melissa: 15:21

Right.

Lenny: 15:22

He's going to teach us that way. He's going to teach you Read and then I will give you understanding. But in those days, you think about how many people were illiterate. They didn't have Bibles, and God needed that church to grow fast, so he gave them knowledge.

Melissa: 15:38

That's right.

Lenny: 15:44

I think a lot of people are discouraged when they read their Bible, when they hear somebody teaching scripture and they seem so much smarter than them. You could say, oh, I'm never going to be that smart. But I don't think that we should be discouraged in that way, because we all have abilities within us. The Spirit will guide us, he will counsel us, he will teach us. But maybe it's not all in the same way either. When you think about the spiritual gifts and you look at what Paul has written to that effect, they were all different, they all had different spiritual gifts. I mean there's just a ton of them. There's a ton of spiritual gifts. You had administration, apostleship, discernment, evangelism, exhortation, faith giving, healing, helps, hospitality, interpretation, knowledge, mercy, prophecy, teaching, tongues, wisdom. I mean there's a multitude of different things and they didn't all have them all.

Melissa: 16:37

They all were parts of the body working together.

Lenny: 16:39

Yes, and so from that we can still take that the body of Christ is going to be diverse. Humans all have different characteristics and it seems to me possible that God was using their human abilities and super accelerating them somehow. It's possible that he was just doing that and today we just have our own human abilities. Some might be better at other things, but we're all going to have a place in the body of Christ. We're all going to have a place. We just need to pray that God shows it to us. Where's our place Right? Where are we going to bear our fruit? But to that effect, you are going to read further into that passage about something that Paul taught on was the most important element.

Melissa: 17:21

Alright. So back in Ephesians, chapter 3, I'll start at verse 13 and go a little further than I read before. So I ask you not to lose heart over what I'm suffering for you, which is your glory, for what I am suffering for you, which is your glory. For this reason, I bow my knees before the Father, from whom every family in heaven and on earth is named, that, according to the riches of his glory, he may grant you to be strengthened with power through his Spirit in your inner being, so that Christ may dwell in your hearts through faith, that you, being rooted and grounded in love, may have strength to comprehend with all the saints what is the breadth and length and height and depth, and to know the love of Christ that surpasses knowledge, and that you may be filled with all the fullness of God.

Lenny: 18:16

Yes, and then in 1 Corinthians 13, he says and that you may be filled with all the fullness of God. Yes, and then in 1 Corinthians 13, he says and if I have prophetic powers and understand all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have faith so as to remove mountains, but have not love, I am nothing. So we see this important theme, that love is so important. And it's the love of Christ, it's the love of our Lord, and it's that love working in and through us.

Melissa: 18:44

That's right.

Lenny: 18:45

Is where we're going to be the most vibrant, bear the most fruit. So whatever we do, we should make sure we're doing it in love.

Melissa: 18:53

Yeah, we found that to be so important in our own growth, in our own life. Yes, the importance of love. And if you're not feeling loving towards people that are brothers and sisters in Christ, people that you want to help, you should pray for the love.

Lenny: 19:07

Yes, so in that passage I remember we were talking about.

Melissa: 19:10

Another interesting conversation we had was how that passage seems to be talking to non-Christians at times passage seems to be talking to non-Christians at times Verse 16, that according to the riches of his glory, he may grant you to be strengthened with power through his spirit in your inner being, so that Christ may dwell in your hearts through faith.

Lenny: 19:30

I know one thing that I always thought was fascinating on the note of spiritual gifts is that faith was a spiritual gift, Right, A spiritual gift of faith. And then there is saving faith. Faith is the vehicle that leads us to salvation. God opens our eyes through faith, Gives us faith, opens our eyes. But then there's this spiritual gift of faith and we're told that it was given in different measures. Same faith, essentially, but in a different way. If it was a spiritual gift of faith, it wasn't a faith that God was building on through our human abilities. It wasn't a faith that God was teaching you through Scripture. It wasn't a faith that God was teaching you through experience. They needed to be equipped for this radical experience that was going on around them. In that first century of Christianity, when the church is building, Satan and all his demonic realms running rampant I mean, it was just total chaos going on and so God was giving people faith as a gift like here. You're going to need this to get through these times.

Melissa: 20:33

Right, like we said, he was jumpstarting the church and he had that limited time window when he wanted things established.

Lenny: 20:41

And I still think we can pray for faith. I still think we can pray for those things, but what you see happening is usually it's going to be a taught faith. I don't think there's a whole lot of miracles going on. God could perform a miracle if he wants to still, and we've definitely experienced things in our lives where, like, wow, that God really opened my eyes there, right. But it's this life experience that he's using to teach us these things, to gradually wake us up to grace, to grow us in grace. However you want to say it, we're developing and growing like a plant grows.

Melissa: 21:13

Yes.

Lenny: 21:13

And in those times he kind of just gave them a lot of fertilizer. I guess you could say yeah, that makes sense.

Melissa: 21:21

But now the church is established and as believers in complete finished work of Jesus Christ, we don't see the earth going anywhere. So, there's no time crunch going on, so we believe God teaches us more gradually through uh, the abilities he's given us yeah, the exodus is over, we're here.

Lenny: 21:41

Yeah, we are in the promised land. We don't need the manna and the coil. We don't, you know, we don't need all those signs and wonders as switchfoot says, salvation is here yeah. So love is a very important and essential part of the Christian faith. Keeps us in check, helps us to realize if we're on the right track or the wrong track. Sometimes it's like, oh, I'm not feeling the love. What's going on?

Melissa: 22:06

Right.

Lenny: 22:07

But power. Getting back to power, you know God was displaying his power. We read the definition of power. I just want to read a few quick verses just to give an example of God displaying his power in scripture. So if you want to read these, these are all from Luke, actually in the NASB translation. If you'd like to read some of these, melissa, Great idea.

Melissa: 22:29

Luke, chapter 1, verse 35. The angel answered and said to her the Holy Spirit will come upon you.

Lenny: 22:46

God displaying his power through the immaculate conception, the virgin birth, christ being born through a woman. Yes, that's power.

Melissa: 22:56

That is power, luke 4, 36. An amazement came upon them all and they began talking with one another, saying what is this message? For? With authority and power, he commands the unclean spirits and they come out.

Lenny: 23:12

So God is casting out demons, displaying his power.

Melissa: 23:16

Yes, luke 6, 19. And all the people were trying to touch him, for power was coming from him and healing them all.

Lenny: 23:26

Christ had power coming from him that was healing people.

Melissa: 23:31

Just by being touched.

Lenny: 23:33

Yeah, In the next passage we see it again.

Melissa: 23:36

Luke 8, 46. But Jesus said Someone did touch me. 46, christ was aware that power had gone out from him.

Lenny: 23:46

A woman had touched him. She had a debilitating illness where she was bleeding constantly. She touched him and was healed.

Melissa: 23:54

Yeah, luke 9, 1. And he called the twelve together and gave them power and authority over all the demons and to heal diseases.

Lenny: 24:04

So that's when he sent out the twelve. That was before Pentecost. He sent out the twelve, then he sent out the seventy. Right they were given power. That was before they indwelled in the Holy Spirit.

Melissa: 24:15

It was.

Lenny: 24:16

But it was still spiritual power.

Melissa: 24:18

Right. Luke 24, 49. And behold, I am sending forth the promise of my Father upon you, but you are to stay in the city until you are clothed with power from on high.

Lenny: 24:31

So they were going to be clothed with Christ, they were going to receive the Holy Spirit. Yeah, christ was the power. They were going to be clothed with Christ.

Melissa: 24:35

They were going to receive the Holy Spirit.

Lenny: 24:36

Yeah, christ was the power. They were going to be clothed with him. Paul speaks about clothe yourselves with Christ. Yes, so yeah, they were going to be given the Spirit at Pentecost. So now we'll be getting into the rest of the passage. Romans 1, 6, and 7, and this is the ESV translation reads including you who are called to belong to Jesus Christ, to all those in Rome who are loved by God and called to be saints. Grace to you and peace from God, our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ". So to all those in Rome who are loved by God and called to be saints. That's who he's writing to. So when we think about called, we hear that God calls all people to himself through the cross of Christ. It's a calling that all people receive. Right, we hear that the cross of Christ Jesus loves you. You could say that to everybody and it's true. It's a common thing that you hear right.

Melissa: 25:31

In universalist circles.

Lenny: 25:34

It's funny you should say that actually because it's a universalist term, but it's used in Arminian and free will theology as well. The two are actually closer together than a lot of people realize and we're going to dig into that in this passage a little bit. We're going to fast forward a little bit into Romans, chapter 8, to try to figure out what this calling is.

Melissa: 25:56

All right.

Lenny: 25:58

I think it's important to understand what called is. So we read Romans 8, verse 27.

Melissa: 26:05

If you'd like to read that, melissa, this will be in the ESV as well, and he who searches hearts knows what is the mind of the Spirit, because the Spirit intercedes for the saints according to the will of God, and we know that for those who love God, all things work together for good, for those who are called according to his purpose, for those he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son in order that he might be the firstborn among many brothers. And those whom he predestined he also called, and those whom he called he also justified, and those whom he justified he also glorified.

Lenny: 26:49

This passage is said to be displaying an unbreakable chain.

Melissa: 26:55

I can see that.

Lenny: 26:56

People have theorized that this is the order of salvation In order. So you can see what happens, in what order is the theory? And I can see that and it makes sense Because you see this unbreakable chain, you have foreknowledge that leads to predestination, and the predestination leads to a calling, and then the calling leads to justification, and then the calling leads to justification, and then the justification leads to glorification. We start with foreknowledge. What is foreknowledge? I know you had defined foreknowledge, melissa, if you'd like to share what you learned from Webster.

Melissa: 27:32

Yes, I did define all these words. Yes, I did define all these words for new, to have previous knowledge of anticipate, divine for see, and I wanted to mention that in scripture often to know is to love intimately.

Lenny: 27:52

I would agree with your definition. Yeah, in regards to scripture, where Webster's is more of a basic definition, more of a worldly definition. That's not what I see in scripture and these passages will help us to understand that. For knowledge is for loved, for no is a very intimate thing. If you study the usage of that term in scripture, it's very intimate. It's not just that he knew something about them, it's not that, oh, I know that they'll act this way, I know that they will do this certain thing in the future, so I love them. It has nothing to do with that. It's a very intimate love.

Melissa: 28:32

Like in Genesis, where it says Adam knew his wife and then she bore him a son.

Lenny: 28:38

Yes. So they were intimate wife, and then she bore him a son. Yes, so they were intimate.

Melissa: 28:44

Yes, exactly, they were referring to intimacy. You see that type of usage quite a bit in scripture.

Lenny: 28:47

Yeah, that's a great example. Romans 11.2,. God has not rejected his people, whom he foreknew. Do you not know what the scripture says of Elijah, how he appeals to God against Israel? So he's referring to Israel. He foreloved yeah, he foreloved Israel. And then in 1 Corinthians 8, 3 in the ESV. But if anyone loves God, he is known by God, so he's connecting it with love again Right Then in 2 Timothy, who saved us and called us to a holy calling, not because of our works, but because of his own purpose and grace, which he gave us in Christ Jesus before the ages began. 1 Peter 1.2. According to the foreknowledge of God, the Father, in the sanctification of the Spirit, for obedience to Jesus Christ and for sprinkling with his blood, may grace and peace be multiplied to you. Then 1 Peter 1, verse 20,. He was foreknown before the foundation of the world, but was made manifest in the last times for your sake. So that's about Christ. Christ was foreknown before the foundation of the world.

Melissa: 29:53

He was foreknown, he was foreloved.

Lenny: 29:56

So there's something much deeper than just known about. He wasn't just known about. Christ existed before the foundation of the world.

Melissa: 30:07

And the Father loved him. The Father had a plan.

Lenny: 30:10

There was an intimate relationship between Christ and the Father before the foundation of the world.

Melissa: 30:17

One of the definitions from Webster that I had read, for new is divine.

Lenny: 30:22

Yeah. Foresee so there's something much deeper than God just predicted the future.

Melissa: 30:27

Right.

Lenny: 30:28

He didn't just predict the future. We can dive much deeper into that once we get further into Romans, but I just wanted to touch on it. It's a love that God had well in advance. And then that leads us into predestined, those whom he foreknew he also predestined. So if you were foreknown by God in this way, you were also predestined to be conformed to the image of his son. You were predestined. So when we get into predestined those whom he foreknew, he also predestined what's the definition that you came up with for predestined, melissa?

Melissa: 31:01

In Webster's it's to settle beforehand, in advance, to designate, assign or dedicate in advance, to direct or set apart for a specific purpose. To direct or set apart for a specific purpose or place prophecy, suffer, endure, feel, sustain, experience, taste and see. To recognize the nature of to be aware of the truth, possessing confidential info.

Lenny: 31:37

It was already known. He foreknew, he foreloved and he predestined, he planned, based on his foreknowledge and his love for you. He planned for you to be part of the kingdom. He planned for you to be with Christ, and so in the verses to support it, we have Romans 9 23,. In order to make known the riches of his glory for vessels of mercy which he has prepared beforehand for glory, 1 Corinthians 2.7. But we impart a secret and hidden wisdom of God, which God decreed before the ages for our glory Ephesians 1.5.

Lenny: 32:13

Esv he predestined us for adoption through Jesus Christ, according to the purpose of his will, ephesians 1.11. In him we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to the purpose of him, who works all things according to the counsel of his will. So we were preordained and then, from preordained, predestined, those whom he predestined he also called. He did. The logic would follow here that if you weren't foreknown or predestined to be conformed to the image of his son, you wouldn't have been called. That's the logic here, if you follow those in order. True, so a calling is something that happens next. Do you have the definition for called, melissa? What does Webster say about called?

Melissa: 33:03

To utter in a loud, clear voice. To announce with authority. To invite or command to meet, to summon, To make a request or demand. To demand surrender of for redemption as of a bond. To speak of or address by name. To give a name, to regard as or characterize as of a certain kind, describe as shout invitation, summons, a request or a command to come or assemble, a calling on another for something due or supposed to be due. Claim request decision.

Lenny: 33:47

Wow, that's a powerful definition. Thank you for that.

Melissa: 33:51

Yeah.

Lenny: 33:52

So what does scripture say about it? In Romans 9.24 we read Even us, whom he has called, not from the Jews only, but also from the Gentiles. So he called from the Jews and the Gentiles Called from them, not just from the Jews, but called from the Jews and the Gentiles. And then in 1 Corinthians 1.9, god is faithful, by whom you were called into the fellowship of his Son, jesus Christ, our Lord. Galatians 1.15, that's Paul talking about his apostleship. Galatians 5.8 Talking to Christians. 2 Thessalonians 2.14. Hebrews 9.15. Finally, in 1 Peter 2.9. Finally, in 1 Peter 2.9, he's talking about the believers here. This calling is a powerful thing. It's not just an open invitation. I'm not seeing wide open invitation in any of that. Are you?

Lenny: 35:25

I'm not but, as Martin Luther said, I wouldn't want a free will, even if I could have one. He understood the pitfalls of that doctrine. He understood the problems in the doctrine and the error. He didn't want to be in error. I'm not saying he was perfect in any way, shape or form, but that statement was very good.

Melissa: 35:43

He knew predestination.

Lenny: 35:44

Yes. Anyways, here's the kicker. Here's the problem that I have with that doctrine. Among many points, this is one extremely strong point. What we read in our verse 827 is that those whom he called, he also justified. So this is where you get that connotation of universalism. That's why you said well, yeah, the universalists would proclaim that. And you're right If you say that this word called is an open invitation. What you're actually proclaiming is universalism.

Melissa: 36:22

Because then everybody would be justified.

Lenny: 36:24

Because those who are called are also justified. So that means Christ is calling all to justification and all are receiving it. All have been justified by the cross. That's not true. That's simply not true. You have to believe in order to be justified. You have to have faith in christ in order to be justified. Universalism is not true doctrine, and so we shouldn't go down that path just to try to prove free will. There's an error there. There's a big problem with that doctrine. That's right. So, having that said, those who are called, those who believe they're justified what is justified, Melissa?

Melissa: 37:10

What would have got for justified is to prove or show to be just, right or reasonable to pronounce free from guilt or blame, defend, maintain, support, uphold, condone and excuse very good, and so in this one I looked up the greek word.

Lenny: 37:35

Instead of just cross-referencing passages. I looked looked up the Greek word that they use for justified in that passage, and then I looked at other passages that use that word and I found that not in all cases was it interpreted as justified. It's kind of interesting and I'll get to that. So Romans 3, verse 4, we read May it never be. Rather, let God be found true, though every man be found a liar, as it is written that you may be justified in your words and prevail when you are judged, and he's talking about God there. God will be justified in his words, god will prevail when he's judged. This is about God. He is true, and every man is a liar. And then Romans 3, verse 20,. Because by the works of the law no flesh will be justified in his sight, for through the law comes the knowledge of sin. So nobody is justified by the law, Romans 3.24,. Being justified as a gift by his grace, through the redemption which is in Christ Jesus Romans 3.26,. For the demonstration, I say, of his righteousness at the present time, which is in Christ Jesus, romans 3.26. Romans 3.28. Romans 4.2. Romans 4.2,.

Lenny: 38:57

If Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God Romans 4.5,. But to the one who does not work but believes in him, who justifies the ungodly, his faith is credited as righteousness Romans 5.1,. Therefore, having been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ, romans 5.9. Much more than having now been justified by his blood, we shall be saved from the wrath of God through him. We were just talking about that. People were saying that we're still under the wrath of God as Christians. He says right here we're saved from the wrath of God through Christ. Anyway, romans 6.7. For he who has died is freed from sin.

Lenny: 39:43

Now, that's the interesting one. I was telling you. Freed is the word that is translated from the same word that is justified and justifies and all these other places. They considered it freed from sin. Kind of interesting. The interpreter kind of made the connection. Justification was kind of like being freed from sin. Pretty good translation, I guess. So once we're foreknown, once we're foreloved, we're predestined. Once we're predestined, we're called. And then once we're called, we're justified. So if you've been called, you're also justified, and then those who are justified are also glorified. What's glorified mean in Webster's Melissa?

Melissa: 40:26

Glorified is to raise to heavenly glory, to light up brilliantly, to represent as glorious, to give glory to, as in worship, to cause, to be or seem to be better than the actual condition. To make glorious by bestowing honor, praise or admiration. To bless, magnify, praise, adore, defy, revere, worship, dignify, exalt.

Lenny: 40:59

And so then our NASB translation in John. These are all from Gospel of John actually John 7, 39. John 11.4, john 12.16, john 15.8, john 17.1, john 17.4. It's Christ talking, christ talking again in John 17, 5. He's going back to his place of glory, going from man on earth, man and God, back to glory with the Father. He wanted to be back with his Father again.

Melissa: 42:27

That's right.

Lenny: 42:29

Why is it so important for us to understand God's sovereignty? Why does it matter so much that we understand that God is sovereign, that God is in control, that God is the one who foreknows and predestines and calls and justifies and glorifies. Why does it matter? Well, right after he wrote about that, paul continued on and he said what then, shall we say to these things? He asked the same question what shall we say about this?

Lenny: 42:56

If God is for us, who can be against us? He who did not spare his own son but gave him up for us all? How will he not also, with him, graciously give us all things? Who shall bring any charge against God's elect? It is God who justifies. Who is to condemn Christ?

Lenny: 43:15

Jesus is the one who died, more than that, who was raised, who is at the right hand of God, who, indeed, is interceding for us? Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall tribulation or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or danger, or sword, as it is written For your sake? We are being killed all the day long. We are regarded as sheep to be slaughtered. No, in all these things, we are more than conquerors, through him who loved us, for I am sure that neither death nor life, nor angels, nor rulers, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers, nor height, nor depth, nor anything else in all creation will be able to separate us from the love of God and Christ Jesus, our Lord. That's why Paul says it matters, and I agree with him.

Lenny: 44:04

Me too, and we don't have to literally like blow up our minds trying to figure it all out, but we just have to believe it. At the end of the day, I guess it's safe to say that Jesus is Lord and he chose you.

Melissa: 44:19

That's right.

Lenny: 44:20

Your identity is child of God. So for today, signing out, and I look forward to seeing you guys next week for some more.

Melissa: 44:29

Have a great day out there.

Announcement: 44:31

Take care of you guys. Thank you for listening to the Waking Up To Grace podcast, brought to you by the finished work of our Lord Jesus Christ. If you enjoyed today's episode, we would love to hear from you. You can send encouragement our way right from our episodes and transcripts page or reach Lenny privately from the contact form at wakinguptogracecom.